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Thread: Builders Guide Model Y Gee Bee (Electric)

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  1.  
    #26
    Join Date
    01-25-2007
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    Lester Alabama, USA
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    476
    Once the pushrods are installed its time to put in the stringers. They must go on before the forward planking due to the way the stringers need to be notched for the planking.
    Attached Images
    Last edited by PipesCS; 01-04-2009 at 10:41 AM.
     

  2. Tail Surfaces 
    #27
    Join Date
    01-25-2007
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    Lester Alabama, USA
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    476
    It has just struck me that the tail surfaces have to be installed prior to the rear fuselage stringers as they nest around the tail.

    The horizontal and vertical stabs. are bult flat over the plans
    Attached Images
     

  3. Battery Hatch 
    #28
    Join Date
    01-25-2007
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    Lester Alabama, USA
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    476
    The battery hatch is built on a flat surface such as a table with an edge. The only critical part on the first steps is to ensure the two ends are perpendicular.

    There is extra material on the base that you will need to bevel sand into the shape of the frames. This is to ensure the skin marries up with it.

    Stringers should be stiff balsa or bass.
    Attached Images
    Last edited by PipesCS; 01-04-2009 at 11:02 PM.
     

  4. More Hatch 
    #29
    Join Date
    01-25-2007
    Location
    Lester Alabama, USA
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    476
    The skin is joined on a flat surface covered with wax paper.

    The skin has square holes to line up with the square pegs located at the top of the framing.

    1. Tack glue the skin to the alignment pegs.

    2. Wet the upper surface of one side to help is bend around the curves. (I cracked mine trying to do it dry)

    3. Put slow CA on the frames and along the one edge of the base piece.

    4. Place the assembly on the edge of the table and slowly form the skin to the frames and base letting the excess skin overhang.

    5. Remove the excess so that the assembly can be reversed to do the
    other side.

    6. Repeat on other side
    Attached Images
     

  5. Hatch 
    #30
    Join Date
    01-25-2007
    Location
    Lester Alabama, USA
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    476
    Once the hatch is formed clean it up and sand the ends till they are a good slip fit. (My hatch started out too tight)

    Add alignment pins to the bottom.

    The hatch on the prototype was secured with a rare earth magnet in each of the four corners
    Attached Images
     

  6.  
    #31
    Join Date
    01-25-2007
    Location
    Lester Alabama, USA
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    476
    Stuck in a hotel in Arizona. Hopefully Bob is working on the wing and can post photos soon.
     

  7. Wings 
    #32
    Join Date
    01-25-2007
    Location
    Lester Alabama, USA
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    476
    While I was working in Arizona John started his wing.

    He sent me three emails with comments but no photos to show you.

    I flew home to night and checked out some of his notes.

    One was that his plans were smaller than the parts. Both his set and the set I am building from came with the short kit from Top Notch.

    First I checked out the parts to find they match the cad drawings perfectly.

    Sure enough when I laid laser cut leading edge on the paper plans there was an eighth inch difference with the plans being shorter.

    I took the part to the prints I had done here ( Also the ones I sent to Model Airplane news for copy) only to find the parts fit with no distortion in the plan. I do not know at this point if the plans that come off the printer at MAN will have a problem.

    Looks like paper printers have some variation.
    Attached Images
     

  8. Building the Wing 
    #33
    Join Date
    01-25-2007
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    Lester Alabama, USA
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    476
    Decided to build the wing on the short set of plans to see what the issues would be.

    As the ribs are tabed and the leading and trailing edges are slotted the wing will come out fine if the first rib is aligned to the plans and the spar is pinned staight over the plans. Bob and I both built over the short plans to make sure it would work.

    NOTE: THE LEADING AND TRAILING EDGE PIECES HAVE A BEVELED END THAT IS FOR THE CENTER SECTION TO ALLOW FOR THE DIHEDRAL. THEY ARE MADE TO BE INSTALLED WITH THE LETTERING (FTE, LE) ON THE PART. UP RIGHT.
    Attached Images
    Last edited by PipesCS; 01-09-2009 at 10:39 PM.
     

  9. Cutting Spar 
    #34
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    01-25-2007
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    Lester Alabama, USA
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    Some how I double posted this. The steps are below
    Attached Images
    Last edited by PipesCS; 01-09-2009 at 11:36 PM.
     

  10. Cutting the Spar 
    #35
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    01-25-2007
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    Lester Alabama, USA
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    One concern with the plans being off was spar length. If cut per the plan it would come up short.

    I used the leading edge stock to mark and cut mine to length.

    1. The lower spar is pinned to the plans using the center line as a reference.

    2. All the ribs were double checked and put in to position without glue.

    3. The false leading ad trailing edges were dry fitted.

    4. Using R-1 as a reference the wing was aligned to the plans.

    5. Once the wing was trued up it was pinned into position and glued using thin CA.
    Attached Images
     

  11. Shear Webs 
    #36
    Join Date
    01-25-2007
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    Once the glue has dried I added the top spar.

    Once the top spar was dried I added the shear webs that are part of the short kit.

    Mine were a good press fit between the two spars but Bob complained his were a little short and that he could see light. He ended up replacing his. I would advise that you make sure you have the spars in the rib notchs before gluing. (Note they may need to be trimed to length between the ribs as I made them a little over length.)

    When I glued the spars on, I matched the ends which come to think of it will need to be sanded to match the dihedral later.
    Attached Images
    Last edited by PipesCS; 01-10-2009 at 12:21 AM.
     

  12. Leading and Trailing Edge 
    #37
    Join Date
    01-25-2007
    Location
    Lester Alabama, USA
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    Once the panel is glued up you can add the one eighth leading edge along with the one qtr inch trailing edge.

    NOTE: The leading and trailing edges have the same beveled end that will have to be lined up on the inboard side of the wing panel
    Attached Images
     

  13. Back to the Tail 
    #38
    Join Date
    01-25-2007
    Location
    Lester Alabama, USA
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    476
    I have gotten home and started to recieve input from Bob over on the east coast who is building a proof model for me. (As you got the kit for free I think your whining a lot).

    The thing is, his questions and imputs are fair as for one he has never seen the design (I never have written a how to) and although he has built hundreds of designs but like me is rather dated on laser kits.

    So I thought I would put his comments in as we go.

    The first was on laying out the tail parts.

    It works best if you pin all the parts to the plan dry and once you have it all lined up go back with thin ca and hit the joints. Bob found that if you glue each joint as you go around the parimiter parts you can get it out of line on the last glue joint.

    You will quickly realize that wood is a living materieal and we noticed that parts that fit on my kit were slightly too small on his
    Attached Images
     

  14. Bobs General Comments on the Wing 
    #39
    Join Date
    01-25-2007
    Location
    Lester Alabama, USA
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    Notes on the wing construction. I meant to be taking pictures of it but never got around to it. Here are the notes so far:

    The laser standoffs (Break Point in the laser lines) have to be sanded off should be emphasized every other sentence. As soon as I would forget to sand one off it would screw me up. I have more CA on my hands from this than any plane I have ever built. When I put the sheeting on and glued it together, it didn't go together nice and tight as I expected from laser cutting and wound up glueing the sheets to the wax paper. On removal I saw what the problem was( space due to the stand offs) but it was too late. Then when I mounted them the glue flowed through those same cracks and all over my fingers.I'm used to much tighter leakproof joints.

    John wanted to know what was missing for a full kit. All the dowels. Those for the wing mount and the pants. The 1/8 front balsa wing doubler is also missing (It is on the Light Ply Sheet where I placed it. Notified John to move it)

    Make sure you point out that the leading edge and trailing edge are not symetrical and have to be oriented

    Dont cut the spars to size until after the wing is glued up

    Sand an angle on the center jont of the spars for a good fit.

    If the shear webs are short due to wood shrinkage cut another set that fit tightly

    Cut off the spar ends after the wing is glued together.

    Take the wing off the building board to glue the doublers on so you can see to center them top to bottom and side to side.This also allows you to glue the top spars to the shear webs without the glue running uphill.

    Sand the leading and trailing edges flush prior to glueing the LE and TE caps on (Ribs stick thru and need to be sanded flush)

    Glue the LE and trailing edge caps on with med CA o allow time for positioning

    The landing gear mounts must be glues up and glued in place prior to sheeting the center section

    Care must be taken to glue up the landing gear mount pairs correctly as they look alike but ar not interchangeable!

    The lower sheeting need to be trimed to size prior to glueing.

    It also needs to have the landing gear mount holes cut into the sheeting as this was apparently overlooked in the laser cutting ( I did not try to do this due to my inability)

    After the lower sheeting is glued in place, roll some monokote backing sheet or paper around a pencil and then thread the resultant tubes into the ribs and glue in palce for the servo wire tubes . Better yet do it before you glue the two wing halves together.

    The top wing sheeting is short so the cut sheet needs to be enlarged or a piece need to be glued to to bring them to size (Will fix)

    Glue the tips up and trim and sand them to shape

    Glue the tips onto the wing ends and add the reinforcin g triangles and trim then to shape

    Shape the leading and trailing edges and fair them with the tips
     

  15. To the Tip 
    #40
    Join Date
    01-25-2007
    Location
    Lester Alabama, USA
    Posts
    476
    One of Bobs comments was that he built up the top of the tips completely on the bench, then unpinning to build up the bottom.

    When I did the tips on the Model D I had assembled them one piece at a time on the last rib. Then shaped the tip to match the leading and trailing edges.

    I thought I would try Bobs method on one wing tip and mine on the other to see which one I like best.

    NOTE: IF YOU BUILD THEM THIS WAY IT IS CRITICAL THAT YOU BUILD THEM OVER THE PLANS TO ENSURE YOU END UP WITH A LEFT AND A RIGHT TIP. I ALMOST MESSED THIS UP

    This is Bobs method.

    One thing is did was to sand the part edges to remove burs and that solved that problem. I used thick ca and as I joined the parts on the waxpaper covered bench top I slid them around to ensure they did not dry in one spot as Bob mentioned.

    Also note that the pieces that make up the tip edges R6 THRU R9 are not symetrical and can be oriented wrong. compare them to the plans to get them turned the right way. (Ask Bob how he knows. Said something about making me attend a design college.)
    Attached Images
     

  16. Just a tip 
    #41
    Join Date
    01-25-2007
    Location
    Lester Alabama, USA
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    476
    Bob mentioned a part on the tip that came up a little short so he had added a small piece of wood to fill the gap.

    New modelers may think that you simply stick a model together but that is not the case.

    Should you come across a joint that does not match up, the art of being a modeler is the ability to cut, fit, sand, make new and keep moving.

    Below is an example. Bob noticed this on the tips of his kit. he filled the joint with balsa scrap. Having been forewarned I checked mint. On the first tip I had a perfect fit. On the tip I built in place I found the piece did not quite fit up against the rib. As I caught it early I simply opened up the slot the part fits in to let it slide up to the rib.

    Older modelers will remember when you had to saw out each piece with the pattern printed on the wood, which was followed by die cut (crushed) kits.

    Laser or CNC really spoils us and we forget you really need to dry fit first.
    Attached Images
     

  17.  
    #42
    Join Date
    01-25-2007
    Location
    Lester Alabama, USA
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    476
    Looking at these photos, I now realize the problem was not with the part but that Bob and I both let the last rib get a warp in it and it is bowed in at the spars.
     

  18.  
    #43
    Join Date
    01-25-2007
    Location
    Lester Alabama, USA
    Posts
    476
    Spoke with John at Top Notch about th drawings being off size. He is adjusting his plotter to fix the problem.
     

  19.  
    #44
    Join Date
    01-25-2007
    Location
    Lester Alabama, USA
    Posts
    476
    Well having tried it my original way of building the tip onto the completed wing panel verses building it flat on the bench and adding it as a whole assembly, I go with Bobs method of adding the completed assembly.

    I only caution that you do not let yourself get carried away and build two of the same tip.

    Take you time and lay out the parts on the plans to ensure you end up with a righ and a left.
     

  20. Dihedral Issue 
    #45
    Join Date
    01-25-2007
    Location
    Lester Alabama, USA
    Posts
    476
    I have had Bob and other comment that I do not mention a dihedral angle.

    I will try to go back and put a measurement from the bottom of the wing to the tip but after building models for over 35 years still do not know why you would need it in this type of construction.

    You are given a frontal view and the actual shape of the doubler.

    My method has always been to glue the two doublers to one wing panel. (ensure it is centered on the spars with a 1/16 inch step on the top and bottom of each side to allow the wing center section panneling to sit flush) and then add the other panel. I usually cut the spars back a little leaving a gap in the center to ensure the leading and trailing edges line up.

    After the center doublers dry I line up the leading and trailing edge to ensure the wing is not warped and glue them with their doublers.

    As shown I do the joining up in the air off the bench. I have yet to have a warped wing this way.

    If you build as Bob does by anchoring one panel to the board and propping up the other tip it would be a simple matter to measure the plans with a ruler. In the mean time I will add the change to the plans and try to get a revised set to MAN prior to their selling a set.
    Attached Images
     

  21. Opps 
    #46
    Join Date
    01-25-2007
    Location
    Lester Alabama, USA
    Posts
    476
    Got my photos a little out of sequence here. The wing panels have tubes leading from the center section out to the wing servo bays. These are to run wires to the servo.

    I make mine from paper but Bob likes to use the clear plastic that is the backing for monocoat.

    NOTE: THEY ARE NEXT TO IMPOSSIBLE TO INSTALL AFTER THE WING PANELS ARE JOINED.

    MAKE SURE YOU PUT THEM IN PLACE PRIOR TO GLUING UP THE PANELS.
    Attached Images
     

  22. Wing Center Section 
    #47
    Join Date
    01-25-2007
    Location
    Lester Alabama, USA
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    476
    The wing center section is completed after the wing halves are joined with a leading and trailing edge doubler. The leading edge one is simply to give a seat for the center wing planking

    The center rib is simply glued in flush with the doublers edges to support the center wing planking. I had to sand mine a little to get them to fit.

    The front center rib comes as a set of three to beef up the area where the 3/16 inch wing mount dowel will be mounted.
    Attached Images
     

  23. Landing gear blocks. 
    #48
    Join Date
    01-25-2007
    Location
    Lester Alabama, USA
    Posts
    476
    The landing gear on the prototype was secured using a fairly dated (Heavy) method.

    The gear blocks are a carry over from my other two designs. They are built up from plywood as I am finding the average modeler may not have access to a model saw to rip out a wire grove.

    The front set of blocks are built up slightly shorter than the rear set as they butt up aggainst R-1. This is because the three short blocks inlet into the side of R-1 weaken it too much to cary the blocks over the top. They blocks should stand proud of the rib wich causes the center planking to be cut in around it.

    The front blocks are also drilled for the wire where the aft ones are not. I did not bend the end up on the aft wire to go into the wing but simply lay in the slot. It was secured with clamps.

    The blocks are epoxied to the plywood struts.
    Attached Images
     

  24.  
    #49
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    01-25-2007
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    Lester Alabama, USA
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    Note that the slots open up on the inboard side.

    The slots for the wire can be made longer if you wish to widen the gear stance.

    This greatly helps ground handling.
     

  25. Rear Blocks 
    #50
    Join Date
    01-25-2007
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    Lester Alabama, USA
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    The rear blocks assemble the same but glue into the slot on R-1, R-2 and R-3

    They have no hole as I did not bend the rear wire to go into the wing. It is simply a brace.
    Attached Images
     

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